carefreeluke

Ozil is overrated

56 posts in this topic

According to Jason Cundy:

"When I say this I don't say it lightly but Arsenal's MesutOzil is the most overrated player in the Premier League," Cundy told Football Fan.Zone, as quoted by Goal. "Every week I get Arsenal fans bigging him up to me, telling me how good he is and that he's world class, but he's not.

"Last week we were forced to bow to the midfielder because he scored a wonder goal against a bunch of Bulgarian farmers to complete an Arsenal comeback but why were Arsenal losing 2-0 in the first place? Who on earth are Ludogorets that we should be getting so excited?"

Cundy believes that Ozil isn't the best player in the Arsenal team either, let alone being world class. The Chilean Alexis Sanchez is a worthier choice for that tag than the German, who only shows up against the underdogs, he said.

I don't necessarily agree with him by the way.

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Who's Jason Cundy? Some great criticisms there, such as 'why were Arsenal losing in the first place?'. 

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Jason Cundy is an ex Chelsea, Spurs and Ipswich player from the 90s. He scored some great goals but had a career plagued with injuries. He is quite an interesting character so he's kept himself in football by doing punditry work over the years for Sky, Chelsea TV and TalkSPORT. Like most people who do a three hour podcast five days a week he tends to over exaggerate (Adrian Durham is a prime example) but the point he often makes about Ozil is he rarely gets praised for making a big contribution against sides better or on par with Arsenal.

Edited by Cabaye My Lover
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I have no problem with any criticism from whoever from Candy to Fawlty as long as it's true and of a fair nature. This point Jason Candy makes is true but why do they pay already famous people from football when they can employ football fans to say these things and more. It's no revelation and I've heard it put better before by a "nobody". 

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Ozil is shite and only Arsenal fans think he is World Class :banana:

 

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4 hours ago, True Blue said:

Ozil is shite and only Arsenal fans think he is World Class :banana:

 

I do have a BIG problem with you criticising any Arsenal player you two timing bitch. :suicide:

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5 hours ago, SirBalon said:

I have no problem with any criticism from whoever from Candy to Fawlty as long as it's true and of a fair nature. This point Jason Candy makes is true but why do they pay already famous people from football when they can employ football fans to say these things and more. It's no revelation and I've heard it put better before by a "nobody". 

To be fair a lot of the weekly regulars on Talksport are not ex professional footballers. Him and Goldstein just compliment each other well and deal with the drunk midnight callers.

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17 minutes ago, Cabaye My Lover said:

To be fair a lot of the weekly regulars on Talksport are not ex professional footballers. Him and Goldstein just compliment each other well and deal with the drunk midnight callers.

I prefer the two mikes, funny as fuck them two but don't come on till 1am in morning. They hardly talk about football (or any sport for that matter), they just ramble shit all night going from one off-topic to another 😂

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Nobody takes that cunt Jasno Cundy seriously. I loved it when Carra schooled him once.

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Throw Sanchez in there also, was very poor the 2nd half of the season last season plus again the season before he switched off 1/2 way through.  He has been very hit and miss this season, wether its down to tiredness, injury or out of position, he hasn't really been the player he can be. 

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This is what people that don't understand the actual workings of a game of football will say. A very British mentality of "if what he's doing isn't obvious then he's not doing anything".

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52 minutes ago, False 6 said:

This is what people that don't understand the actual workings of a game of football will say. A very British mentality of "if what he's doing isn't obvious then he's not doing anything".

Yeah I agree.  Not specifically with Ozil but in general. A lot of pundits use to say Milner did a lot that the untrained eye wouldn't notice 

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Ozil is certainly a player who plays well when the team does, he's not a player to turn a game round and does tend to slink away against better sides. However, that can be said about a lot of players regarded as 'top players'. Key for Arsenal is getting him in a side which can dominate against anyone, they're not there yet.

Edited by The Artful Dodger
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On 11/24/2016 at 2:53 PM, SirBalon said:

I do have a BIG problem with you criticising any Arsenal player you two timing bitch. :suicide:

Like that ever fucking happens :lol:

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He's very overrated, disappears in every big game ever, people can downplay that but it comes back to bite you at the highest levels of the game, that's why RM never could win the Champions League when they had serial big game failures like Ozil on the team, and then won 2 in 3 years when they demoted him to Arsenal and replaced him with a vastly superior player in Luka Modric.

If your ambition is to win major trophies then you much need better than Ozil. 

 

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Oh my days what a poor attempt at trying to rattle Arsenal fans. :lols:

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Although he may seem like he is not a stellar performer there is definitely something that makes him a starter for national team in all the matches in the past few major tournaments and world cup winning side. His inclusion definitely boosted this Arsenal side ever since he joined.

However I will have to agree partially with this guy's argument that Ozil does miss in important matches of the time, but I don't know if its just him or the general mentality of Arsenal and Wenger as a collective and I suspect its the latter and Ozil is just being a part of that. Being said that I don't expect to turn the tide of the game by himself, he is definitely not that kind of a player and he seems to give up easily when things get tough.

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I've watched Özil for years even before he went to Madrid and he's always had the same issues (the negative ones) in that he goes missing in some games and that can sometimes go on for quite some time. 

When the team he's playing for is on top form he becomes an world class performer doing things very few players can do... In otherwords his talents become evident. But when the team is performing lower than their capabilities, he goes missing more times than not and that's undeniable. He's not a constructive central modfielder where you can sometimes miss the hard work that type of player puts in... He's an anchor between the front and the central mechanics of the midfield. In Spain we call this an "interior" like Iniesta, Isco or Arda (he can play there). That player should always be active as his work load is lesser than central midfielders.

In my opinion he suffers from bouts of laziness from having watched him at the actual stadium where you can keep an eye on whoever you want and don't rely on tv where the cameras focus on the actual action.

Why does he always start? Because he is one of those players that can win you games. Because he is one of those talents that in a split moment will come out with some magic and provide you with maybe an underserved victory overall. 

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so the question is should a club have him and pray that the team around him plays well so he can create magic or swap him for a player (if available) who can grab the game by its neck and do something (which may not be as magical as what Ozil does on his day) on the pitch

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1 hour ago, Asura said:

Although he may seem like he is not a stellar performer there is definitely something that makes him a starter for national team in all the matches in the past few major tournaments and world cup winning side. His inclusion definitely boosted this Arsenal side ever since he joined.

However I will have to agree partially with this guy's argument that Ozil does miss in important matches of the time, but I don't know if its just him or the general mentality of Arsenal and Wenger as a collective and I suspect its the latter and Ozil is just being a part of that. Being said that I don't expect to turn the tide of the game by himself, he is definitely not that kind of a player and he seems to give up easily when things get tough.

It's Ozil not Arsenal, he was a big game flop at RM too, and also rarely played 90 minutes due to his laziness, a notable flop was when they got smashed by Dortmund in the 2013 semi final, walked ALL over. Going to a team with a weak mentality and spirit like Arsenal may well exacerbate the problem, but it's not the main cause. 

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18 minutes ago, Asura said:

so the question is should a club have him and pray that the team around him plays well so he can create magic or swap him for a player (if available) who can grab the game by its neck and do something (which may not be as magical as what Ozil does on his day) on the pitch

At Real Madrid there were many games where he was substituted at half time and I don't remember him ever finishing a game for them. There was a famous moment where Mourinho subs him before half time and in the following game Ramos wore Özil's shirt under his own with the number and name at the front... Ramos scored, took off his shirt and showed his solidarity with Özil.

All this said and done... There were various games where Özil was pure magic for Real Madrid and saved them in 50/50 games which is something he doesn't do much for us. 

Edited by SirBalon
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Wouldn't say he is a big game flop. 

Some here put it perfectly. He isn't the type of player to change the game on his own. If the team does well, he does well. If The team is shite, he's shite. He's a critical component in a machine.

 

Circumstances he's been in haven't really helped him either tbf. 

Look at Real for example. Real are a team of individuals who rarely display a collective team performance, hence their embarrassing 1 league title in almost 9 years. 

 

 

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To be fair they're are loads of players who don't perform in the big games constantly. Quote often the man of the matches are players you don't expect. 

Edited by chrisgooner
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37 minutes ago, SirBalon said:

At Real Madrid there were many games where he was substituted at half time and I don't remember him ever finishing a game for them. There was a famous moment where Mourinho subs him before half time and in the following game Ramos wore Özil's shirt under his own with the number and name at the front... Ramos scored, took off his shirt and showed his solidarity with Özil.

All this said and done... There were various games where Özil was pure magic for Real Madrid and saved them in 50/50 games which is something he doesn't do much for us. 

I think the reason he used to get subbed with Real is because of the lack of his defensive capabilities which mourinho wants a lot. He is not a great athlete too and might have been tired quickly. 

But one thing is for sure that when the going gets tough Ozil is not your man to look up to. Arsenal's best in that sense will be Sanchez followed by Cech and Bellerin. I would have rated Jack in the same bracket too if he had played atleast half the matches every season.

 

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Excellent player from ability perspective, but he can go missing. He's not the only one though. Too many players have the ability but few run the show. Lots of very good but bland football players out their. Perhaps the product of over coaching? Bring back the maverick players like Gazza.

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One of the most beautiful footballers I have ever seen, the bloke is just pure magic. I've just come accustomed to the English media's regurgitated shit opinions on Ozil. He is not perfect and does have his faults, but he is World Class and I will still say he is our best player. It's true he is heavily reliant on the team to perform to bring the best out of him, but he is just fantastic.

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45 minutes ago, Chaaay AFC said:

One of the most beautiful footballers I have ever seen, the bloke is just pure magic. I've just come accustomed to the English media's regurgitated shit opinions on Ozil. He is not perfect and does have his faults, but he is World Class and I will still say he is our best player. It's true he is heavily reliant on the team to perform to bring the best out of him, but he is just fantastic.

Chaaay mate, you've also criticised him for exactly the same reasons some (including myself) have done on this thread.

When he is on song (permitting the team is functioning because otherwise forget it) he does indeed seem to be world class.

But a world class player is that player that when the cards are down he can pull a team with his talent.

Look at what Maradona did with Napoli back in the day.

The term "World Class" is awarded too easily these days.

Özil has way too many lagoons in his performances. 

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Quote

Forward Mesut Ozil believes he is being made the scapegoat for Arsenal's problems, according to his agent.

"Criticism is normal if a player plays badly," Dr Erkut Sogut told BBC Sport.

 

"But Mesut feels people are not focusing on his performance; they are using him as a scapegoat for the team after bad results."

 

Against Bayern, the 20 passes that Ozil completed was the same amount as home goalkeeper Manuel Neuer.

 

"Bayern had 74% possession," said Sogut, who is Ozil's lawyer and representative. "How can someone in the No.10 position create chances if you don't have the ball?

 

"In these games people usually target a player who cost a lot of money and earns a lot of money - that is Mesut. But he can't be always be the scapegoat. That's not fair.

 

"Football is a team sport and Arsenal are not performing well as a team. Eleven players were on the pitch but Mesut was singled out for criticism. Was he the reason that Arsenal conceded five goals?

 

"It started before the match, throughout the week leading up to the game. People started discussing: 'Should he play? Should he be dropped?'.

 

"It was as if everyone knew Arsenal would not make it through and we needed a scapegoat. This is not right. You win as a team and you lose as a team."

 

Ozil has scored 29 goals in 146 Arsenal appearances and last season created more chances in a single campaign (137) than any other player in Premier League history.

 

In January, the German was named as his country's player of year for a fifth time in six years, having helped them to the semi-finals of Euro 2016 and World Cup glory two years earlier. But many have accused him of underperforming when it matters most.

 

"I don't agree that Mesut has not had an impact on big matches," Sogut said.

 

"What about the win at home to Chelsea this season and Manchester United the year before? What about the games for Germany against Italy and France at Euro 2016?

 

"People are always saying Mesut is not fighting or tackling, that he has poor body language, but that is how he is.

 

"Believe me, he is desperate to succeed. If it doesn't work, he shows his anger and expressions. Was his body language an issue when Arsenal were playing well?

 

"He is not someone who runs around aimlessly and tackles just so everyone thinks he is fighting. If it doesn't make sense to run somewhere he will keep that power for the next run."

 

Ozil is out of contract in 2018 and there has been no breakthrough on talks over a new deal, but Sogut insisted his player is fully focused.

"I don't think the criticism has affected his performance or his mental state," the agent added.

 

"Mesut is committed to the club. There is no doubt that he will perform at 100%, with total professionalism and commitment as long as he plays for Arsenal. Nothing will change that.

 

"He is sorry to the fans, and he's sorry that he and his team-mates couldn't give the fans a better result in Munich."

 

Edited by carefreeluke
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Özil isn't overrated. Only a madman would deny his undoubted talent. What he is is DAMNED LAZY!

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I wouldn't swap him for any of Lallana, Coutinho, Firmino or Mane and im being deadly serious. 

 

Edited by LFCMadLad
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4 minutes ago, LFCMadLad said:

I wouldn't swap him for any of Lallana, Coutinho, Firmino or Mane and im being deadly serious. 

Same, if we had Liverpool's squad :P

Ozil plays pretty and is as talented as they can get, but he's not as impactful as he should be.

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29 minutes ago, Machado said:

Same, if we had Liverpool's squad :P

Ozil plays pretty and is as talented as they can get, but he's not as impactful as he should be.

He would be absolutely useless in Klopps system. In fact he's pretty much useless in Arsenals. 

He'll probably end up at PSG where he can do fuck all but look great in an absolute piss poor league. 

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Does make me laugh how every time Arsenal lose it's Ozil's fault yet every time Tottenham lose it isn't Alli's fault.

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5 hours ago, The Foxes said:

Does make me laugh how every time Arsenal lose it's Ozil's fault yet every time Tottenham lose it isn't Alli's fault.

To be fair mate even when Alli isn't playing well, he never hides, unlike Ozil. 

I think anyone would take Alli over Ozil every day of the week. 

8 hours ago, SirBalon said:

Özil isn't overrated. Only a madman would deny his undoubted talent. What he is is DAMNED LAZY!

That's the thing though, he's so lazy he's pretty much useless. 

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7 hours ago, LFCMadLad said:

I wouldn't swap him for any of Lallana, Coutinho, Firmino or Mane and im being deadly serious. 

 

You wouldn't be saying that if he played for Liverpool. We have absolutely wasted 3 of his prime years. Guarantee if he was playing for someone like Klopp he'd be sensational.

100% agree with his agent, Arsenal fans love a scapegoat. They shit on Özil every week but I'm sure they'd rip the shit out of him if he left. Genuinely can't stand Arsenal fans a lot of the time now. They have no respect for a lot of our players. We boo Bacary Sagna for fuck sake...

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5 minutes ago, Chaaay AFC said:

You wouldn't be saying that if he played for Liverpool. We have absolutely wasted 3 of his prime years. Guarantee if he was playing for someone like Klopp he'd be sensational.

100% agree with his agent, Arsenal fans love a scapegoat. They shit on Özil every week but I'm sure they'd rip the shit out of him if he left. Genuinely can't stand Arsenal fans a lot of the time now. They have no respect for a lot of our players. We boo Bacary Sagna for fuck sake...

Seriously mate, 90% of the time you don't even know Ozil is on the pitch. Absolutely bone idle and if he did play for Klopp he'd be doing exactly what Sturridge is doing now... Sat on the bench wondering where he'll be playing next season. 

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